What gear to use??

[DJsYnx]

I've been looking through djforums and have noticed how the mainstream equipment of most dj's is either a pair cdj's or turntables and a mixer which requires quite a bit of work to do the similar things to what software can already flawlessly do (beat matching, working out tempo). I was wondering why most people still use cdj's instead of an xponent or vestrax vci 300 that can do a decent amount more as far as mixing.

Is it the simple matter of the skill needed to beat match or the fact that thats what they are used to or that they have spent over 4 grand for the setup that they have??

The first thing i bought when i got 'into' djing was a M-Audio Xponent (which may or may not have been the right choice) as when i researched everything in dj stores and the forums it seemed lightyears ahead of the cdj's and vynl. It works out the tempo, can beat match (which i haven't been using lately), can change speed of the song without affecting pitch (very useful), and has 5 quick que points which makes it like an mpc when using mp3's. It has awsome effects, 16 cell sampler built in to the program etc..... The cdjs and (obviously) vynl don't do any of these things (as far as i know).

I'm just wondering if i'm missing out on something major in using a midi controller and software as opposed to using cdj's. Or is it basically becuase the whole midi/software thing is fairly recent and most people don't want to change what they are using for a few little effects?

Thanks, Drew.

[Tomy]

midi mixing software thing isn't that new... i guess for me moving from vinyl to CD's was a massive step because i felt that cds we pretty lame eg: you BPM is displayed things are a bit easier.... but i'm on cds now because its heaps easier to get around plus most clubs dont provide turn tables anymore.

i think my issue is with the whole mixing software thing is I dont want to go to a gig and see a dj stare into a laptop screne for 2 hours. i think a lot of software takes the skills of beat matching out of mixing.... yes it does free up time for better mixing but that isn't really the point.

I'm not anti mixing software, just think it ruins the atmosphere a lot.

watched a video on xponent, wasn't really impressed i could do any thing the guy did on it on a cdj all with out a program to help me stay in time.... he was using torq with it.....

this is a really negative sounding post... but i'm not trying to sound like a grump.... hahaha

[Skank]

i dont even know where to start with this post

any one can jump on a automix program and mix some tracks. but a dj can read the crowd and actually control the dance floor a dj can scratch and and atmosphere to a room, if all the clubs had some bloke on a chair using virtual dj, night clubs would die and the pub scene would witness a huge surge of life.

at the end of the day people like to see other people perform and entertain its got nothing to do with the price of equipment

in this new digital age everyone is a dj

[Genetic]

ok a simple answer is yes there is technology that does everything for you but if you use this you had better be very creative in what you perform, and you can still perform while using software infact you should perform more!

controllers are designed to have everything at your fingertips and be able to put on a live show so to speak even if they are loops, samples and tracks that have already been made and to some extent bring the sound engineer out from behind his glass booth and recieve recognition for the efforts they make.

being a dj is about connecting with the listener and controlling the music to send them on a journey.

dancing and music is one of the earliest forms of tribalism and creating a connection to everyone.

[tubby]

not sure where people get the impressoin that mixing via midi means you are staring at your screen the whole time. I have every function mapped to my controller, so I look at screen to pick tracks (probably less time than flicxing through record crate or cd wallet), and to see the waveform, again no worse than looking at the record grooves to see what's coming up. the rest of the time, I'm working on the mixer

Still when I'm at home I'll about half the time mix of time code vinyl as I find it more involving, other half trying to really mix it up over midi, that is not just 1 track to another. That is even more involving, but if you are just blending one track to the next it can be boring

[DJsYnx]

midi mixing software thing isn't that new... i guess for me moving from vinyl to CD's was a massive step because i felt that cds we pretty lame eg: you BPM is displayed things are a bit easier.... but i'm on cds now because its heaps easier to get around plus most clubs dont provide turn tables anymore.

i think my issue is with the whole mixing software thing is I dont want to go to a gig and see a dj stare into a laptop screne for 2 hours. i think a lot of software takes the skills of beat matching out of mixing.... yes it does free up time for better mixing but that isn't really the point.

I'm not anti mixing software, just think it ruins the atmosphere a lot.

watched a video on xponent, wasn't really impressed i could do any thing the guy did on it on a cdj all with out a program to help me stay in time.... he was using torq with it.....

this is a really negative sounding post... but i'm not trying to sound like a grump.... hahaha

Np Tomy,

Thanks fo your input.

I've been reading up a bit more and it seems that most people on djforums seem to think that midi is great for getting into djing as it's cheap and a lot easier than cdj's and vynl. I think i'll wait till i have and can properly use cdj's before i play anyway too major.

[Tomy]

yeh i think it is a great idea. i'm all for software and controllers although i will probably not use it.

like genetic said

yes there is technology that does everything for you but if you use this you had better be very creative in what you perform, and you can still perform while using software infact you should perform more!

[Genetic]

it's a shame to say it but gone are the days where a dj's skill and talent were of beat matching, set construction and mixing in key manually.

but there are still some great dj's out there who with the introduction of new technology learn the ins and outs of the new equipment and utilise it to it's full potential.

with the advent of midi mapping in most "dj" mixers it's starting to allow for more creativity and user friendliness, towards implimenting software into a set.

[CBG]

Sorry mate, but you make me feel a little sick inside.

The fact that you consider yourself somewhat of a DJ dissapoints me.

I dont care what anyone says. You cannot consider yourself a DJ until can comfortably beat match two songs, adjust the pitch etc. Im sick of hearing all this noobs saying they can DJ with their software driven bullshit.

Answer me this... could walk into a club, any random club, with your own CDs or Vinyls and comfortably pump out a 3hr set, with minimal faults, using their gear?

[CBG]

oh just for the record. I do not disagree (sorry bout the double negative) with midi controllers or things like serato (more or less the same). I disagree with all the abilities that software seem to carry like: "It works out the tempo, can beat match, can change speed of the song without affecting pitch" )allthough the tempo lock comes with most CD players these days, I dont promote it either.

Sorry for the harshness of my previous post... but my god it annoys me. Seems every kid with VDJ and a sense of beat is a DJ now yeah?

[DJsYnx]

oh just for the record. I do not disagree (sorry bout the double negative) with midi controllers or things like serato (more or less the same). I disagree with all the abilities that software seem to carry like: "It works out the tempo, can beat match, can change speed of the song without affecting pitch" )allthough the tempo lock comes with most CD players these days, I dont promote it either.

Sorry for the harshness of my previous post... but my god it annoys me. Seems every kid with VDJ and a sense of beat is a DJ now yeah?

Sorry if i offened you in my post, i was just trying to find some answers. I can change my username if it annoys you.

Drew.

[CBG]

oh just for the record. I do not disagree (sorry bout the double negative) with midi controllers or things like serato (more or less the same). I disagree with all the abilities that software seem to carry like: "It works out the tempo, can beat match, can change speed of the song without affecting pitch" )allthough the tempo lock comes with most CD players these days, I dont promote it either.

Sorry for the harshness of my previous post... but my god it annoys me. Seems every kid with VDJ and a sense of beat is a DJ now yeah?

Sorry if i offened you in my post, i was just trying to find some answers. I can change my username if it annoys you.

Drew.

Hey I said sorry dude.

Don't take the easy road out. You will regret it. It's bloody satisfying to wrestle with the tempo of two songs and bring them together with your own hands and as you said before, the industry standard is still a mixer 2 CDJs and/or turntables. So stick with that, if you plan to work your way up anyway.

[Skank]

id say if your going to get software Serato 100% you still have to do everything you would with out the laptop but instead you can do so much more in so much less time

[CBG]

id say if your going to get software Serato 100% you still have to do everything you would with out the laptop but instead you can do so much more in so much less time

Yeah serato is mad. Doesn't take away the human element and enables smoother looping

[DJsYnx]

I'm not intending on taking the easy road out. I've used a 5000 dollar pioneer steup before (2 CDJ 1000 MK3 and an 800 mixer) and i was beat matching (a few pretty nice fades and a few crappy ones), I got a good taste of what it's like using cdj's and it was a lot of fun.

But so is doing live remixes of songs with midi stuff(not just two tracks playing at the same time but the sort of stuff you'd do in reason or fruity loops but live).

After the replies i've gotten back on this thread i'm no longer gunna use the sync features or wave form displays when mixing and see how i go.

Thanks for your replies,

Drew.

[wazza]

oh just for the record. I do not disagree (sorry bout the double negative) with midi controllers or things like serato (more or less the same). I disagree with all the abilities that software seem to carry like: "It works out the tempo, can beat match, can change speed of the song without affecting pitch" )allthough the tempo lock comes with most CD players these days, I dont promote it either.

Sorry for the harshness of my previous post... but my god it annoys me. Seems every kid with VDJ and a sense of beat is a DJ now yeah?

Sorry if i offened you in my post, i was just trying to find some answers. I can change my username if it annoys you.

Drew.

Hey I said sorry dude.

Don't take the easy road out. You will regret it. It's bloody satisfying to wrestle with the tempo of two songs and bring them together with your own hands and as you said before, the industry standard is still a mixer 2 CDJs and/or turntables. So stick with that, if you plan to work your way up anyway.

CBG..you were so close to getting Flame buy me

if it was not for second post

to lable all software d.j as try-hards want-to-be's who have not taken the hard road is in my eyes bill-shit

@synx use what feels right for you

[DJsYnx]

oh just for the record. I do not disagree (sorry bout the double negative) with midi controllers or things like serato (more or less the same). I disagree with all the abilities that software seem to carry like: "It works out the tempo, can beat match, can change speed of the song without affecting pitch" )allthough the tempo lock comes with most CD players these days, I dont promote it either.

Sorry for the harshness of my previous post... but my god it annoys me. Seems every kid with VDJ and a sense of beat is a DJ now yeah?

Sorry if i offened you in my post, i was just trying to find some answers. I can change my username if it annoys you.

Drew.

Hey I said sorry dude.

Don't take the easy road out. You will regret it. It's bloody satisfying to wrestle with the tempo of two songs and bring them together with your own hands and as you said before, the industry standard is still a mixer 2 CDJs and/or turntables. So stick with that, if you plan to work your way up anyway.

CBG..you were so close to getting Flame buy me

if it was not for second post

to lable all software d.j as try-hards want-to-be's who have not taken the hard road is in my eyes bill-shit

@synx use what feels right for you

Thanks man, thats all i really wanted to hear.

Drew.

[CBG]

I'm not intending on taking the easy road out. I've used a 5000 dollar pioneer steup before (2 CDJ 1000 MK3 and an 800 mixer) and i was beat matching (a few pretty nice fades and a few crappy ones), I got a good taste of what it's like using cdj's and it was a lot of fun.

But so is doing live remixes of songs with midi stuff(not just two tracks playing at the same time but the sort of stuff you'd do in reason or fruity loops but live).

After the replies i've gotten back on this thread i'm no longer gunna use the sync features or wave form displays when mixing and see how i go.

Thanks for your replies,

Drew.

Hey man, if you've allready used Pioneers and learnt how to beat match, its completely different. I thought you were an absoloute beginner.

If you are performing live, and want to do it with a laptop. Then beatmatching is not that much of a problem. As Live and others do that anyway.

Personally, Im not a massive fan of watching dudes stare into their laptops. But good DJs balance it well such as Deadmau5: He uses Live, one of those crazy metonomes or whatever their called, a SEU and Xone 32 mixer.

[CBG]

oh just for the record. I do not disagree (sorry bout the double negative) with midi controllers or things like serato (more or less the same). I disagree with all the abilities that software seem to carry like: "It works out the tempo, can beat match, can change speed of the song without affecting pitch" )allthough the tempo lock comes with most CD players these days, I dont promote it either.

Sorry for the harshness of my previous post... but my god it annoys me. Seems every kid with VDJ and a sense of beat is a DJ now yeah?

Sorry if i offened you in my post, i was just trying to find some answers. I can change my username if it annoys you.

Drew.

Hey I said sorry dude.

Don't take the easy road out. You will regret it. It's bloody satisfying to wrestle with the tempo of two songs and bring them together with your own hands and as you said before, the industry standard is still a mixer 2 CDJs and/or turntables. So stick with that, if you plan to work your way up anyway.

CBG..you were so close to getting Flame buy me

if it was not for second post

to lable all software d.j as try-hards want-to-be's who have not taken the hard road is in my eyes bill-shit

@synx use what feels right for you

It's called constructive criticism and i wasnt aiming it directly at DJsYNX

[DJsYnx]

I only used cdj's a little (my mates a dj and i've used his gear a few times at parties and whatnot) but as far as playing in clubs and using my own gear i'm pretty new at that. I really just wanted to know why midi hasn't gone mainstream and i guess it's all about what is fun for you and what you want to do as far as mixing. Just spining tracks with midi is pretty boring compared with spining with cdjs'.

though i think i'm more on the producer side than dj side so i'd rather use midi and do live remixes rather than just spin tracks. I want to do more like what daft punk do (i think you could almost call them midi DJ's) and a 5000 dollar pioneer setup isn't going to help me do that.

Thanks,

Drew.

[CBG]

I only used cdj's a little (my mates a dj and i've used his gear a few times at parties and whatnot) but as far as playing in clubs and using my own gear i'm pretty new at that. I really just wanted to know why midi hasn't gone mainstream and i guess it's all about what is fun for you and what you want to do as far as mixing. Just spining tracks with midi is pretty boring compared with spining with cdjs'.

though i think i'm more on the producer side than dj side so i'd rather use midi and do live remixes rather than just spin tracks. I want to do more like what daft punk do (i think you could almost call them midi DJ's) and a 5000 dollar pioneer setup isn't going to help me do that.

Thanks,

Drew.

It sounds to me that you arent against CDJs so much but favour a computer based cue system?

Then why not use Serato? Basically enables you to look like your average club DJ but with a laptop to mount your songs. Maybe run Live through another channel for your loops and samples?... i dunno.

[DJsYnx]

No i'm not against cdj's at all i just think that there's more that cam done than just spining. But i guess that most dj's don't want do too much more which in that case cdj's would be best.

I've been using torq as thats what comes with the xponent and it does some of what i want to do but i will look in serato.

Thanks, Drew.

[wazza]

if your looking to do producer side you need to look at midi that works with your work-flow & the software you have got

my hole d.j set-up works all together

thinking about which peace off gear I need to do the job & how it will work with the gear I have

I use for the producer side my midi is

a M-Audio finger trigger for drum beats

a Edirol pcr 500 key board for Vsti

the sound card is a Edirol FA-66 firewire

Software is Ableton & Sonar

now for the D.J setups

I use 2 vastex PDX mk2 turntables with a mixer or a Vestax VCI-100 midi controller

if i'm using the mixer I use Stanton SCS d3 midi controller

for the software I use mixvibes PRO time code vinly

why mixvibes because I can use my Edirol FA 66 sound card & all the midi controllers I Have

I also have 2 cdj 1000 mk2

for a small gig I just take my VCI-100 & the Stanton SCS or the Finger trigger

it all works together in some way

[DJsYnx]

if your looking to do producer side you need to look at midi that works with your work-flow & the software you have got

my hole d.j set-up works all together

thinking about which peace off gear I need to do the job & how it will work with the gear I have

I use for the producer side my midi is

a M-Audio finger trigger for drum beats

a Edirol pcr 500 key board for Vsti

the sound card is a Edirol FA-66 firewire

Software is Ableton & Sonar

now for the D.J setups

I use 2 vastex PDX mk2 turntables with a mixer or a Vestax VCI-100 midi controller

if i'm using the mixer I use Stanton SCS d3 midi controller

for the software I use mixvibes PRO time code vinly

why mixvibes because I can use my Edirol FA 66 sound card & all the midi controllers I Have

I also have 2 cdj 1000 mk2

for a small gig I just take my VCI-100 & the Stanton SCS or the Finger trigger

it all works together in some way

Yeah i plan on getting a trigger finger or a korg padKONTROL when i get some money together. I was also thinking of working a synth into the whole setup (a Korg R3) and see how that goes. It's probably more like a one man band thing then rather than a dj but it would have endless possibilities.

[wazza]

if your looking to do producer side you need to look at midi that works with your work-flow & the software you have got

my hole d.j set-up works all together

thinking about which peace off gear I need to do the job & how it will work with the gear I have

I use for the producer side my midi is

a M-Audio finger trigger for drum beats

a Edirol pcr 500 key board for Vsti

the sound card is a Edirol FA-66 firewire

Software is Ableton & Sonar

now for the D.J setups

I use 2 vastex PDX mk2 turntables with a mixer or a Vestax VCI-100 midi controller

if i'm using the mixer I use Stanton SCS d3 midi controller

for the software I use mixvibes PRO time code vinly

why mixvibes because I can use my Edirol FA 66 sound card & all the midi controllers I Have

I also have 2 cdj 1000 mk2

for a small gig I just take my VCI-100 & the Stanton SCS or the Finger trigger

it all works together in some way

Yeah i plan on getting a trigger finger or a korg padKONTROL when i get some money together. I was also thinking of working a synth into the whole setup (a Korg R3) and see how that goes. It's probably more like a one man band thing then rather than a dj but it would have endless possibilities.

get the finger trigger....why because

it works good with the torq you have for EFX & it comes with Ableton LE

up-grade to Ableton fill & re-wire your torq & abletol together

that will give you a fun little set-up with some power