CDJ350 to have autosync???? HOW SHIT!

[djarmed]

i have known for a while now that the new pioneer cdj350 decks were coming out but only today did i bother having a quick read about them.

And to my DISGUST! they have an autosync feature......how f'ing LAME.

I understand they want to target the "beginner" market but fucking hell a big part if not the BIGGEST part of dj'ing is learning i repeat LEARNING to beat match. So great the DJ population in the world is going to go ten fold over night. then were going to have little wankers running around calling themselves dj's with their autosyncing cdj350's

Kinda pisses me off.

What are other peoples thoughts??

[eggssell]

hmmm this one is a hard one. i guess its what you perceive a dj to be.

if its driving a journey via music then surely the medium doesnt matter.

i mean people using a laptop or controller with traktor or ableton live doesnt necessarily have to beatmatch. and if they can put on a rocking set/mixtape, is that not djing?

of course playing out live with a premade set is not playing out as a dj, because playing out needs to involve reading the crowd.

but if you do the above on the fly, even without beatmatching then to me that is still djing. and im sure ive said it here before, i would rather go to a place where a controllerist rocks it then go somewhere where the person is using two turntables, a 2 channel analogue mixer with a seperate effects unit who can beatmatch like a pro but can't keep a room vibing.

of course the other side is, if djing is like a martial arts where techniques are to be learned and passed on from gen to gen with the only change being the music and the crowds. then yeah putting that on a device does take away from the art of djing. but doesnt any advancement? wasnt putting cue buttons on a cdj already allowing a larger number of people to get into djing? there was a time when dj's of my time were saying the same thing about anyone who dared bring out a cdj at our parties.

personally im not fussed. its not the tools its the person. and is it really that bad having heaps of people interested in getting in the game?? more people to the forum! ha ha ha.

[CBG]

Lol, me and jonny were just talking over PM about the same issue. But I'd prefer to keep my entire thoughts private for now.

Yeah it's really shit whats happening. The auto sync crowd is growing faster than ever, it's all around us. Those that do it, know who they are and they need to realise that it isn't true DJing. That's all I'm gunna say.

[pulsebeat]

thats pretty lame

now famous all these wannabees will think its easy as fuck and as u saind CBG were going to have little wankers running around calling themselves dj's with their autosyncing cdj350's

its kinda like a mate of mine

skank, when he sold his old decks sold it to some kid who, after playing dj hero, thought it was easy as pushing some buttons... pretty lame but i classify a djer as someone who uses turntables and does the whole work by themself and no laptop dj setup like traktor

just my opinion

[djarmed]

hmmm this one is a hard one. i guess its what you perceive a dj to be.

if its driving a journey via music then surely the medium doesnt matter.

i mean people using a laptop or controller with traktor or ableton live doesnt necessarily have to beatmatch. and if they can put on a rocking set/mixtape, is that not djing?

of course playing out live with a premade set is not playing out as a dj, because playing out needs to involve reading the crowd.

but if you do the above on the fly, even without beatmatching then to me that is still djing. and im sure ive said it here before, i would rather go to a place where a controllerist rocks it then go somewhere where the person is using two turntables, a 2 channel analogue mixer with a seperate effects unit who can beatmatch like a pro but can't keep a room vibing.

of course the other side is, if djing is like a martial arts where techniques are to be learned and passed on from gen to gen with the only change being the music and the crowds. then yeah putting that on a device does take away from the art of djing. but doesnt any advancement? wasnt putting cue buttons on a cdj already allowing a larger number of people to get into djing? there was a time when dj's of my time were saying the same thing about anyone who dared bring out a cdj at our parties.

personally im not fussed. its not the tools its the person. and is it really that bad having heaps of people interested in getting in the game?? more people to the forum! ha ha ha.

i perceive a dj to be someone with some skill and doesn't rely on a computer program or autosync.

fair enough use programs to manage your tracks like rekordbox, but not something that takes most of the skill out of djing

[CBG]

It's such an open subject. I have a lot of respect for guys like Deadmau5 and Sashs, who wouldnt be able to do the things they do without things like auto sync. BUT Sasha is old school and learnt on decks and Deadmau5 doesn't like being called a DJ.

So basically, the term 'DJ' is wrong, your dont Jockey discs, you dont ride the platter or the pitch.

So maybe if you use auto sync, you just shouldn't call yourself a DJ?? There needs to be a new terminology

[eggssell]

dj armed, so you saying that controllerist who can pick the right track to drop in, and drop it in at the right moment, as well as make use of effects, cuts and live sampling have no skill??

dont get me wrong, i am no way comparing a freshie controllerist with a veteran who uses a turnie and saying is one better then the other.

i mean luke was not a better jedi then obi wan, but gven the right tools he blew up the death star!

what i am saying is a dj is a music selector. has been for a longtime so i think for controllerists who mix that way are djs. deadmus distinguishes himself i believe because he feels he is making music live, as opposed to seecting music

[Skank]

i recon there just aiming at people who arnt buying dj gear because theyd rather use virtual dj and so on, pretty smart now cause they can look the part with out an ounce of skill

[eggssell]

i classify a djer as someone who uses turntables and does the whole work by themself

but doesnt that mean you are saying half the peeps here aint dj's because they cant/ dont use turnies?

i have turnies but i am definitely no dj compared to others on here.

but like you said its all a matter of opinion that i think can be argued till the sun rises but will never get solved.

like mac or pc, star trek or star wars, nintendo or sega. oh wait that one was answered where are you now sega fan boys!! nintendo 4 life

[ill_spector]

yeh not a fan of the beatlock idea on the cdj 350.

but the rekordbox support is tempting, however it doesn't have hot cues which suks so pretty much it's only good for lazy ppl who don't wanna burn cd's?

but the djm 350 looks sick

it has the colour fx from the 800 and it had a great usb record function (you just stick a usb stick into the mixer and press record) and u can put mark it when a new track comes in etc, great idea

deff going to look into one pending price

[Skank]

i just watched one of the video for the cdj350, it doesnt lock the two tracks together it just keeps all tracks at the same bpm so its still up to you to launch or drop the track at the start of a bar or phase otherwise it will sound shit

[Buck_Choi]

[Buck_Choi]

recording onto usb frmo mixer in high quality wav is a good feature on the djm350, playback on the mixer is good too so if your lazy jsut plug it into your mixer.. and also converting vinyl into high quality wav.

cdj350... meh all good

[JonnyB]

hmmm this one is a hard one. i guess its what you perceive a dj to be.

if its driving a journey via music then surely the medium doesnt matter.

i mean people using a laptop or controller with traktor or ableton live doesnt necessarily have to beatmatch. and if they can put on a rocking set/mixtape, is that not djing?

of course playing out live with a premade set is not playing out as a dj, because playing out needs to involve reading the crowd.

but if you do the above on the fly, even without beatmatching then to me that is still djing. and im sure ive said it here before, i would rather go to a place where a controllerist rocks it then go somewhere where the person is using two turntables, a 2 channel analogue mixer with a seperate effects unit who can beatmatch like a pro but can't keep a room vibing.

of course the other side is, if djing is like a martial arts where techniques are to be learned and passed on from gen to gen with the only change being the music and the crowds. then yeah putting that on a device does take away from the art of djing. but doesnt any advancement? wasnt putting cue buttons on a cdj already allowing a larger number of people to get into djing? there was a time when dj's of my time were saying the same thing about anyone who dared bring out a cdj at our parties.

personally im not fussed. its not the tools its the person. and is it really that bad having heaps of people interested in getting in the game?? more people to the forum! ha ha ha.

yeah but the more we accept new things, the more new things are going to be made, and soon enough, we will have people doing killer sets just by clicking a single button that chooses the correct track and drops it at the corrct time and beat matches it perfectly, with just a single click of the mouse and people will say 'yeah but it gets the crowd pumping dosent it'

when it gets to this point, the dj will no longer be a dj but simply someone who plays music to a club, clubs will no longer hire the guy that spins the vinyl, because they can get the same thing out of a guy with a laptop who is bound never to make a mistake.

A Dj aka a Disc Jokey AkA someone that uses turntables should stay as a DJ, the more controlled the environment gets, the further you get from the dj.

people who use laptops in my opinion are not a dj, ive no problem with what they do, im sure they can crank a party, and if i go to a party and there is a guy on a laptop, i wouldnt have a care in the world if he is pumping the music

but sorry mate, you a not a dj, you play music from a computer you do not spin vinyl like a Disc Jokey

[djarmed]

dj armed, so you saying that controllerist who can pick the right track to drop in, and drop it in at the right moment, as well as make use of effects, cuts and live sampling have no skill??

dont get me wrong, i am no way comparing a freshie controllerist with a veteran who uses a turnie and saying is one better then the other.

i mean luke was not a better jedi then obi wan, but gven the right tools he blew up the death star!

what i am saying is a dj is a music selector. has been for a longtime so i think for controllerists who mix that way are djs. deadmus distinguishes himself i believe because he feels he is making music live, as opposed to seecting music

not saying these people dont have skill. just saying they're missing one of the fundamental skills. their was a day when your mixer had no EQ's just a crossfader so you had to have it beatmatched so that even the transition from deck A to B would sound half desent.

Like johnny b said i dont think these people can call the,selves dj's maybe just as you say yourself a contollerist.

[djarmed]

in saying all this stuff i forgot to mention that if you have been a dj and you have learned to beatmatch properly and your confident on your decks then i dont see a huge problem with using your software everynow and then or autosync, just as long as you dont become reliant on it.

The thing is this person has atleast learnt the fundamentals and has an understanding of what to do if autosync shits itself.

its just annoying, think about it alot of people here put in alot of effort to learn to dj and mix properly. For some people it can take years, and were all still always learning new things and ways to make mixes or mashups sound awesome. But we all ultimately came from the same place, hence why we all respect each other on this forum.

We all crawled, then we walked and now most of us can run.

i just dun like the fact that autosync will skip the crawl stage because thats what it was and still is for people tedious and slow but how rewarding is it when you look back and realise that you are what you are today from years of experience.

Were not what we are today because we bought cdj350's 1 hour ago from djwarehouse hahaha

[eggssell]

now i assume when we all saying laptop we talking software dj's not dvs dj's (else that pretty much wipes out the bulk of headliner dj's, and i would dare not say they aint dj's cuz they use serato or traktor scratch).

so fair enuff i get what you all saying.

and jonnyb i agree in that a dj needs to pick the music, still needs to know when to drop it, hence why i never indicated i support software/ hardware that could do this. in fact i said i see dj as a music selector hence the need to be able to do the skills above. i just dont see why turntable users would see cdj users as any less a dj, or cdj users seeing controllerists as any less a dj, and so on.

and my opinion about someone able to rock a crowd was evident in the last event i went to. a veteran international dj played a perfect set in terms of beatmatching, phrase matching and was probably in key, but by 10 minutes into his set all hands were down, while just before that we were all raring to tear the roof off!. within 40 mins i had mates that were ready to sleep. at that point i would of easily taken a djtech tool guy on his vci with a midi fighter over this international any day if that guy could keep the vibe going. in my opinion despite this internationals perfect dj technique he had lost what it meant to be a dj.

but hey all matter of opinion right.

[djarmed]

now i assume when we all saying laptop we talking software dj's not dvs dj's (else that pretty much wipes out the bulk of headliner dj's, and i would dare not say they aint dj's cuz they use serato or traktor scratch).

so fair enuff i get what you all saying.

and jonnyb i agree in that a dj needs to pick the music, still needs to know when to drop it, hence why i never indicated i support software/ hardware that could do this. in fact i said i see dj as a music selector hence the need to be able to do the skills above. i just dont see why turntable users would see cdj users as any less a dj, or cdj users seeing controllerists as any less a dj, and so on.

and my opinion about someone able to rock a crowd was evident in the last event i went to. a veteran international dj played a perfect set in terms of beatmatching, phrase matching and was probably in key, but by 10 minutes into his set all hands were down, while just before that we were all raring to tear the roof off!. within 40 mins i had mates that were ready to sleep. at that point i would of easily taken a djtech tool guy on his vci with a midi fighter over this international any day if that guy could keep the vibe going. in my opinion despite this internationals perfect dj technique he had lost what it meant to be a dj.

but hey all matter of opinion right.

hahaha who was the dj?

[CBG]

i find it hard to believe that a dj who can mix seamlessly and harmonically cannot program properly. programming is something you learn before beatmatching, and harmonic mixing. programming is almost common sense, anyone with a clue and decent knowledge of music can drive a dancefloor.

a skilled dj add the extra element, the epic 32 bar transition which builds to a massive drop through eqing, filters etc etc.

y take that away from a skilled dj, by just staring at a screen, pressing play and pressing sync. "look at me guys...no hands!!"

[eggssell]

the djs name adds nothing to the point. and id rather not slag a legend considering i cant beat match (yet, well so i hope).

and chris thats exactly what i mean. the dj should have seen the crowd feeling a little bored and done something about it. im sure part of it was my personal music preference and i wasnt digging his tunes, but judging from the amount of people who decided to get a drink rather than dance, i wasnt the only one. and you could definitely feel the energy dying.

a skilled dj add the extra element, the epic 32 bar transition which builds to a massive drop through eqing, filters etc etc.

so your saying that someone must do this using turntables (or I guess cdj's) to be a dj?

take a very long winded example

someone using an mpd, vci, an lpd8, kontrol X1 etc. with traktor has track A going. loads up track B hits auto sync, cues it back to where he wants to start it. then drops it in at the perfectly phrased point, and brings in just the highs using the internal EQ's, then while the two are perfectly laid over the top of each other. he loads track C, hits auto sync to track A. sets a loop of just the horns in track C and adds a reverb effect. waits until track A is in a breakdown then drops track C over the top.

then before track A can come back fades it out, while sending the track C horns into an echo, then fades that out allowing track b to continue.

is that not djing because no disc was being jockeyed?

again i am not comparing. i mean ill take z-trip over girl talk any day of the week. not only because he kills it on the decks (and he uses it w/ a laptop by the way), but also because i personally think z-trip mixes are much better as opposed to some of the novelty of girltalk is nostalgia and picking the sample.

[djarmed]

what do you use eggssell?

[CBG]

using 3 or more tracks at once is a different story. auto sync can be justified because its too hard to manage.

im talking about ppl who jump on vdj and claim to be djs, they get the credit and take it away from hard working, raw skilled djs that learnt from the roots.

wat is a vdj user gunna do if he submits a bangin set, wins a comp and then is asked to play in a club. he is presented with 2 cdjs... wat then?

n im sry but the reality is in the club industry you will get laughed at. someone here was saying they got asked to do a set and they wanted to bring their laptop in w vdj hooked up... no give that work to someone who deserves it. ive seen it b4. ppl getting the glory just bcus they press play and hold sync.

its giving djs a bad name, ppl think its easy and that we dont do nething...and thanks to fucking dj hero, its even worse.

[JonnyB]

now i assume when we all saying laptop we talking software dj's not dvs dj's (else that pretty much wipes out the bulk of headliner dj's, and i would dare not say they aint dj's cuz they use serato or traktor scratch). this only applies to those dj's who use the auto sync'

so fair enuff i get what you all saying.

and jonnyb i agree in that a dj needs to pick the music, still needs to know when to drop it, hence why i never indicated i support software/ hardware that could do this. in fact i said i see dj as a music selector hence the need to be able to do the skills above I understand your point here, but a few years ago the idea of a 'dj' was someone who could use the turntables, continuesly stay in beat, show off his skills, now the perception of the dj has changed, my problem is not what people do infront of a crowd, but how the perception of a 'dj' is seen, if in only a few weve let a dj go from a turbtablist into someone who uses a laptop, whos to say in the next few years a dj could be accepted as (in a hypothetical situation with technology advancements) someone who just uses itunes with a mixing feature downloadable for itunes. . i just dont see why turntable users would see cdj users as any less a dj, or cdj users seeing controllerists as any less a dj, and so on. They would see this because the turntablist trains for months and years to perfect what he does, and then he see's a 15yr old kid come along with a macbook pro and do th same thing with only a few weeks practise, it takes the novelty away as well as all those years practising. thats why a turntablist would not see a person on a laptop or someone using a autobeatmatching device as a DJ, he wouldnt nesecarrily think hes not an entertainer, because he may be pulling a massive crowd. but he is still not a Disc Jokey, in the original sence.

and my opinion about someone able to rock a crowd was evident in the last event i went to. a veteran international dj played a perfect set in terms of beatmatching, phrase matching and was probably in key, but by 10 minutes into his set all hands were down, while just before that we were all raring to tear the roof off!. within 40 mins i had mates that were ready to sleep. at that point i would of easily taken a djtech tool guy on his vci with a midi fighter over this international any day if that guy could keep the vibe going. in my opinion despite this internationals perfect dj technique he had lost what it meant to be a dj.

but hey all matter of opinion right. This just means the international was a shitty entertainer, not a shitty dj.

[JonnyB]

is that not djing because no disc was being jockeyed?

in my honest opinion, no it is not. i am not saying this person is not talented, because he sure would be, but the point ive been trying to get across is, a dj is someone who is a disc jokey for entertainment, if someone is not using a disc, how can they call themselves a DJ?

Deadmau5 is Not a Dj, he is an Entertainer. and a bloody good one, so there is no reason why someone on a laptop cant be a good entertainer, but they need to take a leaf from deamau5's book, he knows he isnt a dj, and he says he isnt a dj, but he knows he is a bloody good perfeormer which is why people go to see him,

[eggssell]

ive got two stanton st-150's which i use w/ traktor scratch pro (because i have crap loads of electronic format music, and the only vinyl i have are my battle records, the entire beatles collection, and a whole bunch of 12" i collected b/w 87-90. i wonder if my kylie minogue locomotion 12" will be worth anything. it was a present i swear! ).

i may have mentioned before i only use traktor in absolute mode (i.e. other than being a carriage for the mp3's and recording my sets, i dont use traktor for anything else), mainly because i am still focused on trying to learn how to mix then mess around with anything else. but having read about and seen people use relative mode and hot cues i am not anti using it.

i also do have an mpd which i want to setup such that i can browse and load tracks without touching the keyboard, as well as use hot cues to drop samples or play some syncopated sounds over tracks. but again i am still at step 1 of learning so it gathers dust except every once and a while i put on the drum machine software that came with it and bash some beats on it.

cbg, true i dont know the pro scene and im sure it would be frustrating to see a talentless dj get gigs.